Kuzari Argument Comment

from Reheating The Bath

I am reposting a comment from my post, reheating the bath:

In response to HGLP, who wrote:

I don't particularly like the Kuzari argument the way most people state it, as a formulaic "proof". We have a historical tradition all the way back the the writing of the Torah, the Torah is basic history, the Documentary/Supplementary Hypothesis relies on an insane conspiracy theory, is based on the stupidest of "evidence" you have ever seen, completely ignores our entire history of textual interpretation, and is massive historical revisionism, that's all you need to know.

I responded:

Yes, it is extremely simple! And no one questioned it until idiot Spinoza. It is the stupidest form of conspiracy theory I’ve ever seen! Flat-Earth x10! You said your point very well.

BUT! Here’s why it is a bit more complicated, and IMHO relies on the ideas in this post: (There’s a few layers so hear me out.) What is a conspiracy theory and why don’t we believe in them? In other words, why do we accept any history to be true and not assume it to be a conspiracy?

Let’s use an example. Man went to the moon; I think we can all agree on that. But how do we know? We weren’t there. We probably all never met anyone who met anyone who was even involved in being there (if you do, kindly use a different example). So how do we determine if it really happened, or if it’s really just some big prank which some crazy bored people conspired to perpetuate such a story? Maybe the *theory* that it was a *conspiracy*is correct?

Simply put, the reason is because the “not believing” that man went to the moon is crazier than “the believing” that he did. The amount of people that would have to be in on such a conspiracy, and the lengths taken to back up the story is simply so unbelievable that accepting that it happened is simply more reasonable. And not believing it makes you an actually unreasonable person.

Before we continue, if a few hundred years ago the same claim was made, even if with the same fanfare and media attention, it would rightfully acceptable to assume conspiracy version because before Newton’s mathematical calculations, escape from earth was impossible. So to believe in such a story would be so unreasonable that the counter conspiracy theory would win. Now that it’s anyways not such a crazy idea as per our scientific knowledge and technology, the pendulum swings to believing it happened. Basically, it’s a judgment call, which story more reasonable. Though, to be very clear, the judgment made at the end is a statement of pure fact. We can be confident in our belief that man went to the moon.

Here’s where we come in: The Matan Torah story is lucidly clear. The conspiracy theory is unbelievable stupid. BUT. And this is the important point. To a scientifically rational atheist, believing in God is SO UNREASONABLE, so “irrational”, that almost any conspiracy theory would be more reasonable than believing that God gathered a nation around a mountain after turning the actual Nile river in this very world to blood and gave these scientifically ignorant people the Torah.

(They then continue to convince themselves that the DH actually makes sense, and they twist and turn every which way to placate themselves to believe that it is made up and they claim that is so obvious that only real primitive people would believe such things. Now every question on our heilige Torah is just a proof to what they already know. Morals, science, archeology etc. R"L.)

The only way to truly answer them is to point out calmly where they go wrong: Their very rationality of which they are so proud is irrational. Rationality is subjective, and since they are blind to any kedusha, it obviously doesn’t exist. I’ll reuse my mashal that I’ve used now several times (used in the navi אז תיפקחנה עיני עירים and in the Rambam extensively), color to a blind person is irrational. It doesn’t make “sense” to him (not a pun; it’s the actual meaning of the word…). A blind person today doesn’t deny color because anyone else around him will tell him off immediately. He understands that it is actually rational to trust everyone else or he’d be constructing his own conspiracy. But if the world were 99% blind (through some pandemic c’v), people would conclude that seeing a room in one shot is magical and fairy tale. Color sounds like hearing marshmallows and smelling smiles. (It happens to be a near perfect mashal, worth pondering over, maybe for another time...)

We, who know what kedusha is, and we spend our lives in the beis midrash where what’s “rational” is the world of HKBH and His heilige Torah, have no problem at all, whatsoever, with a river turning into blood. We know that we don’t understand the Arizal, let alone the levels of a heilige Tanna. Matan Torah is perfectly reasonable, and we see the conspiracy theory for what it is. So, it all boils down to your connection with HKBH and how real His world is to you.